"I Want It That Way" Mid8 = "That's The Way It Is" Verse
"The One That Got Away" Mid8 = "Part Of Me" Mid8
"Till The World Ends" Verse beginning = "Part Of Me" Verse beginning
If you know more, post 'em! ;)
That was spot-on!
Teenage dream chorus = Your body chorus (the first bars)
teenage dream verse = gimme gimme gimme chorus (abba)
mamma mia verse = oops i did it again chorus (this one is tricky, its just the metric and the melodic motion)
what the hell verse (first bars) = e.t. verse (first bars too)
there is a lot of stuff like that on max stuff, if i have time later will post more
this is very interesting!
yes, please keep posting
This is cool! They obviously have certain melodies on the brain, and they end up on multiple songs they've written around the same time. max_martin_fan, I think the ABBA similarity might be pure coincidence on "Oops", because that chorus was based off Barbra Steisands "Woman In Love", though for all we know that might have been inspired by "Mamma Mia" to begin with.
*Your Body = California Girls = Abracadraba (jessie J)
Quote from: Joshua on August 08, 2013, 10:50:25 AM
This is cool! They obviously have certain melodies on the brain, and they end up on multiple songs they've written around the same time. max_martin_fan, I think the ABBA similarity might be pure coincidence on "Oops", because that chorus was based off Barbra Steisands "Woman In Love", though for all we know that might have been inspired by "Mamma Mia" to begin with.
yup, youre right on that one.
Quote from: Voodoo on August 10, 2013, 09:15:07 AM
*Your Body = California Girls = Abracadraba (jessie J)
incredible, never heard that song before. if the verse and the pre weren't so weak it could be a great song btw
Dr. Luke's mentor was/is Max Martin. Luke, in an interview, gave the advice to dissect great songs you admire in order to boil down and find the common denominators of intervals in those melodies. It is no small wonder Max's body of work represents tried and true common intervals from his other hit songs.
Likewise with effective harmonies on his final choruses in songs; he studied the common intervals in ABBA's harmonies and made them his own goto grab bag. Just like the Beatles studied the close, almost dissonant, harmonies of the Everly Brothers and found their own variation for their early hits.
Quote from: soundoffhear on September 16, 2013, 03:39:12 AM
Dr. Luke's mentor was/is Max Martin. Luke, in an interview, gave the advice to dissect great songs you admire in order to boil down and find the common denominators of intervals in those melodies. It is no small wonder Max's body of work represents tried and true common intervals from his other hit songs.
Likewise with effective harmonies on his final choruses in songs; he studied the common intervals in ABBA's harmonies and made them his own goto grab bag. Just like the Beatles studied the close, almost dissonant, harmonies of the Everly Brothers and found their own variation for their early hits.
Really good points, soundoffhear.... Do you remember where you saw that interview talking about intervals? I saw one where Luke talked about finding common chord progressions that work, but not intervals. I figured out on my own --just from listening-- back @2006 that they were using certain intervals, but I never actually heard them (or Luke) talk about that at all, so it would interest me to read that :-)
Quote from: soundoffhear on September 16, 2013, 03:39:12 AM
Dr. Luke's mentor was/is Max Martin. Luke, in an interview, gave the advice to dissect great songs you admire in order to boil down and find the common denominators of intervals in those melodies.
Yes, I agree this is a great point... and I think it's something I've probably done subconsciously over the years. As in, I've gone around in circles until I've managed to find a Max-like moment in my own songs, rather than knowing specifically and technically what I'm looking for.
QuoteI figured out on my own --just from listening-- back @2006 that they were using certain intervals,
Hi George,
can you give us a little example of what you found out about the intervals?
First lines of the chorus in "since you been gooooone" & "I just want you to knooooow", just so happen to be written around the same time!
Quote from: georg_e on September 16, 2013, 07:13:04 AM
Do you remember where you saw that interview talking about intervals? I saw one where Luke talked about finding common chord progressions that work, but not intervals.
Where is the interview with him talking about chord progressions?
I don't remember where or what he said exactly. I digest so many bits of interviews over the years. I think in one interview he said something in passing, such as "study songs you love, and you will see patterns that repeat themselves in those songs" Then I heard Stargate talking about taking apart melodies from the great songs of the 20th century and finding common intervals that tend to be used over and over.
I think I inferred what Dr. Luke meant. So many of the songwriting interviews done are devoid of technical description from the songwriters. You do have to infer what they technically do as a process.
Quote from: soundoffhear on September 23, 2013, 09:11:03 PM
Where is the interview with him talking about chord progressions?
I don't remember where or what he said exactly. I digest so many bits of interviews over the years. I think in one interview he said something in passing, such as "study songs you love, and you will see patterns that repeat themselves in those songs" Then I heard Stargate talking about taking apart melodies from the great songs of the 20th century and finding common intervals that tend to be used over and over.
I think I inferred what Dr. Luke meant. So many of the songwriting interviews done are devoid of technical description from the songwriters. You do have to infer what they technically do as a process.
That interview with Dr. Luke you're asking about was in "American Songwriter" about 3 years ago -- it's easy to find online still. I have a feeling that might be the one you read, because he was talking about studying chord progressions in the same way you mentioned.
That's great what Stargate said, because alot of those intervals do go way back, used in hit songs of the 30's and 40's, but of course in a very different style of rythym, etc. :-)
Quote from: georg_e on September 23, 2013, 11:32:40 PM
That interview with Dr. Luke you're asking about was in "American Songwriter" about 3 years ago -- it's easy to find online still. I have a feeling that might be the one you read, because he was talking about studying chord progressions in the same way you mentioned.
That's great what Stargate said, because alot of those intervals do go way back, used in hit songs of the 30's and 40's, but of course in a very different style of rythym, etc. :-)
http://www.americansongwriter.com/2011/02/dr-luke/
Do you have some advice for aspiring songwriters?
For people that are making music, there are certain classic progressions. Find those standard chord progressions that a thousand songs have been written with and try to find great melodies to go over that. If you can name six hit songs that were written on those three chords then you know there's a hit song to be written there.
Then there is no excuse. You have to write something stellar then. For lyricists, same thing. Find people you really love and listen to them and learn from them. I did a lot of analytical listening when I was first started. I'm still always listening to things and checking them out. I'm surrounded by people who are really excited about what they are doing. I get to learn and teach and all that stuff. It's great.
Avril Lavign - I will be & James Blunt - Carry you home
listen to this at 04:19
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR8D2yqgQ1U
Quote from: royeei on December 13, 2013, 04:16:03 AM
listen to this at 04:19
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR8D2yqgQ1U
genius
The beginning of the chorus is similar to "Roar": http://youtu.be/nZ_aALzzGjs?t=49s
This must have been revenge for having copied the verses of "We are never ever getting back together" hahaha
Quote from: Rex on December 24, 2013, 02:09:09 AM
The beginning of the chorus is similar to "Roar": http://youtu.be/nZ_aALzzGjs?t=49s
This must have been revenge for having copied the verses of "We are never ever getting back together" hahaha
:o haha both similarities are amazing! Nice find!
Btw this topic was actually about how Max and his writers are using the same melodies in different songs but I like your examples too!
Quote from: Rex on December 24, 2013, 02:09:09 AM
The beginning of the chorus is similar to "Roar": http://youtu.be/nZ_aALzzGjs?t=49s
This must have been revenge for having copied the verses of "We are never ever getting back together" hahaha
good find!. its a shame the pre-chorus is so weak/generic, otherwise it would be a great song.
by the way, not max martin, but the first bars of this chorus are similar to firework by katy perry
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmQkoMnnXDs
"firework" reminds me of a song by erasure, i can't figure out which one. I also find chorus from "My life would suck without you" and "who knew" quite similar
Quote from: Rex on December 24, 2013, 01:16:48 PM
"firework" reminds me of a song by erasure, i can't figure out which one. I also find chorus from "My life would suck without you" and "who knew" quite similar
Also MLWSWY and International Smile: "You got a piece of me" vs. "That girl's a trip"
hey check it out and first go here
http://www.whosampled.com/Max-Martin/
then http://www.whosampled.com/Dr.-Luke/
this wil open up your eyes that.. in fact how much was sampled.
for example tik tok was sampled from a song in 1984
five minutes of funk
also that britneys song toxic uses samples from an indian song
Quote from: Rex on December 24, 2013, 01:16:48 PM
"firework" reminds me of a song by erasure, i can't figure out which one. I also find chorus from "My life would suck without you" and "who knew" quite similar
Yup... Katy Perry - Firework and Erasure - Always have the same pre-chorus.
Quote from: nznexus on December 24, 2013, 07:49:57 PM
hey check it out and first go here
http://www.whosampled.com/Max-Martin/
then http://www.whosampled.com/Dr.-Luke/
this wil open up your eyes that.. in fact how much was sampled.
for example tik tok was sampled from a song in 1984
five minutes of funk
also that britneys song toxic uses samples from an indian song
There aren't so many songs with samples actually, and some of them are just a phrase :-\. It might be a coincidence those 3 words in the tv commercial and in california gurls. btw, i was listening to "I knew you were trouble", and the way she sings "i Knew you Were" reminds me of wrecking ball "We clawed, we chained"
Quote from: Rex on December 26, 2013, 11:58:54 PM
There aren't so many songs with samples actually, and some of them are just a phrase :-\. It might be a coincidence those 3 words in the tv commercial and in california gurls. btw, i was listening to "I knew you were trouble", and the way she sings "i Knew you Were" reminds me of wrecking ball "We clawed, we chained"
It's the style of the melody. Those songs have the verses full of leaps, rather than steps/half-steps, with a very repetitive pattern. It also happens in Your Body by Christina Aguilera.
r u seriuous? there is alot of sampled stuff
Quote from: nznexus on December 27, 2013, 03:33:28 PM
r u seriuous? there is alot of sampled stuff
Nothing credited as a sample, so I think it doesn't count...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FW4e5KgcK4Q the intro same with ''Dark Horse''
Quote from: DMartin on January 05, 2014, 03:34:03 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FW4e5KgcK4Q the intro same with ''Dark Horse''
Hmmm it's not a rare melody and the harmonies are totally different. Therefore I wouldn't let this count :D
Quote from: DMartin on January 05, 2014, 03:34:03 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FW4e5KgcK4Q the intro same with ''Dark Horse''
Yes , it's a bit similar.
Quote from: nznexus on December 27, 2013, 03:33:28 PM
r u seriuous? there is alot of sampled stuff
I mean, there are just 8 songs there, not much if you count like 20 number one hits and a lot more of 40 top songs..
btw, i remember another similitud between "Beauty and a beat" and "time machine", in the part where they sing "So all I need/Cause all I need" during the chorus
Also, birthday' "You know that I'm the girl that you should call" verse sounds a bit like "never met a girl like you before" (Edwyn Collins), i'm not sure about this anyway
Quote from: Rex on January 10, 2014, 10:07:30 PM
Also, birthday' "You know that I'm the girl that you should call" verse sounds a bit like "never met a girl like you before" (Edwyn Collins), i'm not sure about this anyway
Nahhhhhhh you can't compare this ...
hahah why not? the other day i was listening to it on the radio (Edwyn Collins' song, not birthday) and i sung that part, it fit nice
The whole feeling is so different. Firstly the chord progression, secondly the position of this particular melody. In Katy's song it's the final line before the chorus, in Edwyn's song it's the beginning line of each verse.
Even though it's just a remake, one can hear a similarity between the beginning of this song (only the first second) and the beginning of a new song by Max Martin, Dr. Luke & Cirkut ;)
http://youtu.be/B3iI-44egI4
Quote from: B Steady on January 22, 2014, 12:22:43 PM
Even though it's just a remake, one can hear a similarity between the beginning of this song (only the first second) and the beginning of a new song by Max Martin, Dr. Luke & Cirkut ;)
http://youtu.be/B3iI-44egI4
which new song??
Quote from: B Steady on January 22, 2014, 12:22:43 PM
Even though it's just a remake, one can hear a similarity between the beginning of this song (only the first second) and the beginning of a new song by Max Martin, Dr. Luke & Cirkut ;)
http://youtu.be/B3iI-44egI4
Yes! , It reminded me too to ''Unconditionally'' before to know you meant it.
Quote from: Raul_esp on January 23, 2014, 01:44:08 AM
Yes! , It reminded me too to ''Unconditionally' before to know you meant it.
Good ears my Spanish friend :D
I mean it's not only the same note, it's also a similar atmosphere
The original song was written by Frank Ocean.
I fucking love Brandy, she's the best in the game.
I think there are a number of Martin/Luke songs that use snippets of files from other songs. Dr. Luke has a great interview with ASCAP 2011 where he talks about listening to audio files of songs and using them in other songs. It's a great interview and he has his computer with him to show what he's referring to. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d15TvXXd_3Y&feature=share&list=UUlEa60-tjgRin9Zt7T9Ndng I've noticed a lot of similarities with The One That Got Away and I Knew You Were Trouble.
The similarity in pop songs is what initially got me interested in Max Martin. I wondered why so many hit songs sounded like a specific style and started looking at song credits, etc. and discovered they all had one person in common. I think it's great that he's finally showing up more in public appearances and people are remembering his name. It's nice to see he's up for 2 2014 GRAMMYs with Song of the Year/Roar, along with Luke, Bonnie McGee, Katy Perry and Henry Walter. Taylor Swift's RED is up for Album of the Year.
Rebekah, i also believe that they use snippets. In "Roar", during the second verse, when katy says "You held me down but I got up" the second time, a "dada" can be heard, and it kinda sounds like the "dadadada's" in please don't leave (P!nk)
Quote from: Rex on February 02, 2014, 09:52:20 PM
Rebekah, i also believe that they use snippets. In "Roar", during the second verse, when katy says "You held me down but I got up" the second time, a "dada" can be heard, and it kinda sounds like the "dadadada's" in please don't leave (P!nk)
They do!
I have a new one... The chorus of "One More Night" sounds like the first verse in "fix you" by coldplay, but accelerated. And also, the chorus in "beauty and the beat" and "Time machine" (Robyn) are pretty alike ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kO4LawJFjE The chorus reminded me of "Whataya Want From Me" :)
WTF? I listened to the whole song twice and i haven't noticed that similarity..
nsync song gone and justin timberlake cry me a river sound almos tthe same!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbRwSI8yi1o
Was working on writing a song tonight, and afterwards for some reason this really uncanny coincidence popped into my head...and this one I'm SURE is a coincidence......we know that the bass line of "Roar'' is from "Outro" by M83, so that's no coincidence.......but here's the wild thing.....the first three notes of that bass line is exact same as the bass line on the verses/prechorus of "Since U Been Gone" :-) (Both songs have four note bass lines -- only the last note is different). They even have the same beats per measure on each chord, even though the songs are different tempos. It's not exactly a common progression, either....... I II- Vi-
"The wild thing?" M83 yes. Since You Been Gone, no.
Quote from: AlexanderLaBrea on April 15, 2014, 10:24:55 AM
"The wild thing?" M83 yes. Since You Been Gone, no.
You have it exactly backwards........
Depending on how you read it, but yeah there are probably a big influence from M83 in the way they arranged the guitar-part, although, definitely none taken from Since U Been Gone. Just because they happen to have the same (common) intervals.
Quote from: AlexanderLaBrea on April 15, 2014, 05:20:35 PM
Depending on how you read it, but yeah there are probably a big influence from M83 in the way they arranged the guitar-part, although, definitely none taken from Since U Been Gone. Just because they happen to have the same (common) intervals.
Not what I was saying at all....was pointing out the COINCIDENCE with "Since U been Gone", as I wrote:
"Was working on writing a song tonight, and afterwards for some reason this really uncanny coincidence popped into my head...and this one I'm SURE is a coincidence....."
And that pattern is not that common......can you name another song that uses that?
Chorus melodies of "My Life Would Suck" and "A Girl Like Me" are definitely re-workings of each other.....listen from .36 -- first 8 bars ONLY........
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nO5et139rgA
........the basic shape of these melodies is the same -- the important points -- with some differences......on "My Life Would Suck" they improved it by stretching the notes waaay out and landing the melody note on word "how" on the minor third chord......... (on "Girl Like Me" that note -- on word "way" -- lands on the V chord) The melody on "I just can't pretend" is basically same shape as "Forever uniiiiiited".
Hey guys... the reality is that PEOPLE STEAL for inspiration. Even the pros. They even steal from themselves. And they DEFINITELY steal from songs that they love that either nobody knows or the whole world knows. Its all inspiration. Remember the great quotes: "Good composers borrow, great ones steal."
Quote from: Voodoo on April 26, 2014, 11:57:55 PM
Hey guys... the reality is that PEOPLE STEAL for inspiration. Even the pros. They even steal from themselves. And they DEFINITELY steal from songs that they love that either nobody knows or the whole world knows. Its all inspiration. Remember the great quotes: "Good composers borrow, great ones steal."
I know that already, duh........
We all do.
I do it too.
Sometimes I hear a nice chord progression but the melodies are not that good... so I write a topline over the same chords and try different arrangements.
Five - "Don't you want it" pre chorus ("baby I can make the nights last forever ..."
vs.
Britney Spears - "Cinderella" pre chorus ("Here we are, with nothing but honesty ..."
Rihanna - Unfaithful
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp4UwPZfRis&t=1m32s
Ariana Grande - Problem
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SoJ8s90NLc4&t=0m29s
Quote from: ray on May 31, 2014, 11:50:33 AM
Rihanna - Unfaithful
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rp4UwPZfRis&t=1m32s
Ariana Grande - Problem
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SoJ8s90NLc4&t=0m29s
You're right , The melody is very similar , I love this kind of melody in progression.
Backstreet Boys - As Long As You Love Me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Gl2QnHNpkA&t=1m02s
Britney Spears - I Will Be There
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oShxr8UII_I&t=0m36s
QuoteFor people that are making music, there are certain classic progressions. Find those standard chord progressions that a thousand songs have been written with and try to find great melodies to go over that. If you can name six hit songs that were written on those three chords then you know there's a hit song to be written there.
Hi people
This is Dr Luke quote ( you can see it earlier in this topic ) .
I know everyone has his own technics of writing melodies, but i want to put a spot on this one by Luke.
I would like to hear from you ( if it will be possible to express it by words here ) how do you take to the practical area the Luke's sentence- " If you can name six hit songs that were written on those three chords then you know there's a hit song to be written there "
I take it to mean exactly what he said. Don't see the confusion here.
I dont see any confusion.
I know my question need to have deep answer, i wanted to here from people ( if it is possible to express ) how do they do it in the practical area , i mean for example - you take the rhythm from here the melody from there... etc.
Again , i know someone who want to answer my question needs to get really into it, but i am really curious to see exactly how people do the combination between the songs with the same chord progression.
- you can do it even in existing songs, i mean you can say for example that the song "Hot n cold " is a combination among this and this and this...
Ariana grande - greedy
https://youtu.be/CGq7eI7Y9Gw?t=50s
The hook 'you know that i'm greedy for love'
Neiked - Sexual
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzUrUQfgTjE
THe same melody as in Ariana Grande repeats throughout the song
'been running around for so long, now I caught you I wont let you go'
Although not sure who here stole from who
Quote from: system_09 on February 12, 2017, 12:37:50 AMAlthough not sure who here stole from who
They all stole from Mozart.
PS They won't sue nobody because they have the same copyright controlling service Kobalt.
Quote from: system_09 on February 12, 2017, 12:37:50 AM
Ariana grande - greedy
https://youtu.be/CGq7eI7Y9Gw?t=50s
The hook 'you know that i'm greedy for love'
Neiked - Sexual
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzUrUQfgTjE
THe same melody as in Ariana Grande repeats throughout the song
'been running around for so long, now I caught you I wont let you go'
Although not sure who here stole from who
I love Sexual. I hope it will be a hit worldwide.
Onerepublic - wherever i go (0:59)
https://youtu.be/jclnm-0ktHM
Weeknd - earned it (0:35)
https://youtu.be/xe_iCkFsQKE
Same melody.
I actually made a thread about this awhile ago, cuz in every aong nowdays you can hear motifs stolen from other songs
Also
Katy perry-chained to the rhythm (0:39)
https://youtu.be/8gsGhdZDC-0
Jessie j - price tag (1:00
https://youtu.be/qMxX-QOV9tI
Quote from: system_09 on February 16, 2017, 11:10:19 AM
Also
Katy perry-chained to the rhythm (0:39)
https://youtu.be/8gsGhdZDC-0
Jessie j - price tag (1:00
https://youtu.be/qMxX-QOV9tI
oh nice, good find!
seems to be a working rhythm pattern :)